12 MINUTES OF EVIDENCE BEFORE SELECT COMMITTEE 1{ ev has to be fiated ; it has to go to the parishes to be applotted by the vestries, and then P. R. Gamble, it goes to collection ; but the Committee will readily know that it is not - easy to raise v money under any tax ; the way I have received that public money is by sums of ( 9 May,) from 100/. to 200/. and by the time I have received 200/. 1 have become indebted in the sum of 400/. to different persons. So that you advanced the money P— Decidedly; I was more frequently in ad- vance for the grand jury, than I have ever been in their debt; that fact is on the face of my books. Would not the prisoners have been without food and without other necessaries, if you had not been responsible, by advancing your own money for those supplies? — Upon my word I should think they would, though I know if I applied to the court of King's Bench, they would have ordered food instantly. Have the prisoners ever made any complaint of being left in that destitute situa- tion ?— Yes, they have; they have complained to me of getting bad provisions, which when sent away, they were, for two or three hours without food, as the large quantum required could not be procured quickly. Have they ever been left without food in consequence of the want of supplies ? — No. 1 > 0 YOU mean to say, you have paid your own money on account of the gaols ? — I mean that when 1 was in better circumstances I have done so. Then the case might occur in which the prisoners would be in absolute want, if the inspector did not choose to advance the money ?— Certainly, unless by advance of money, or personal responsibility, I think so; of course there would be redress by the court of King's Bench, if applied to. How many prisons do you attend, and what are their relative situations?— I at- tend live prisons, there are three of them in one street, the fourth prison, the Smithfield penitentiary, is about an English mile from that street, and I think the Richmond bridewell is two English miles from that, indeed rather more. Are you inspector of all those prisons ?— Yes. In virtue of your office, as curate of Saint Michan's ?-— The late Act of Parliament made the curate of Saint Michan's inspector of the prisons. Will vou state to the Committee your duties as inspector, in as full a manner as you can ?— I am directed by the statute to attend all the prisons twice a week, and oftener, if necessary, to visit every apartment in each prison, to redress the griev- ances of all the prisoners, as far as is in my power; to oversee generally the pro- viding of all articles, and to check generally the receipt of those articles. Do you visit every cell ?— Yes, every cell. Do you make a return of the state of the prisons to the judges;— I do, every term, to each of the four judges and to the grand jury, and to the inspector general once a year, and a general annual return to Parliament through the inspector general. The inspectors general constantly visit the Dublin prisons themselves. Is it not part of your duty to examine whether the rules and regulations of the prisoners are attended to?— It is. Is not that rather a troublesome part of your duty?— It is very troublesome. Those rules are very numerous and complicated in their nature?— They are. That takes up a considerable portion of your time ?— It does; that is my duty according to the statute. Is it not your duty to insert in your reports whether those regulations have been observed ?— It is. You have the power also of reporting on the conduct of the gaolers and turnkeys and all the sub- officers of the prisons?— Yes. Do those various duties take up a very considerable portion of your time ?— They do, certainly. Under whose immediate control are you placed as inspector ?— First under the government, then the four judges of the King's Bench: there is also a controlling power in the four different grand juries ; the four sessions grand juries, which are always sitting, assume a control, and the inspectors general have the final control. Is it not part of your duty to attend to the contracts for the supply of pri- soners ?— I receive the article sent in in the gaol of Newgate only; I see the articles sent in in the other prisons, but I am not the person who keeps the stores in the other prisons. Can you state how often the cells and other parts of the prison of Newgate are whitewashed?— I can state it correctly; one yard in succession is whitewashed every week