12 MINUTES OF EVIDENCE BEFORE SELECT COMMITTEE Jf). Why do you think that an extravagant charge?— As far as my own experience John McMullen: enables me to judge, I think it impossible that brushes in that quantity, or of that v —' value, could be used in an establishment such as the bridewell, in so short a period. ( 30 April,) can yOU point out any other instances ?— In the same presentments I observe an item for white- washing, painting and scouring the house- keeper's apartment; I think the charge for scouring ought not to occur in a gaol for the employment of convicts ; that it ought to be done by the prisoners. What is the sum?— 11/. 6J. 7d. for white- washing,- painting, papering and scouring. The white- washing, painting, papering and scouring were all included in the n /. 6 s. 7 d. ?— Yes, but it was for the housekeeper's apartment only. Does the same observation apply to the white- washing ?— It does, it ought to be done by the convicts. Does it apply to the painting?— Perhaps, neither to the painting, nor the paper- ing, although I have no doubt there are convicts in the gaol fully competent to do both. Will you give any other instances?— I observe in the same presentment a charge, for white- washing the sheriff's prison and the city marshalsea, 34/. Why do you think that an extravagant charge?— From their limited extent, I think, 34/. a very large amount for white- washing the sheriff's prison and the • city marshalsea. You are aware that it cannot be done by the prisoners themselves?— I am quite aware of that. Have you reason to doubt its being done?— No. In the preceding presentments for Easter term 1820,1 find a charge for brushes, mops, and some other articles for Richmond bridewell, 221. 4s. 6d. which appears to me to be unnecessarily large. Is that the same prison that the others were for ?— The same prison, in the pre ceding half year; in the course of 1821, the presentments for this apparently insignificant item of expense, amount to 78/. is. 7d.; this is for brushes only. Is there any other instance ?— There appears to me in these presentments to be an unusually heavy, and frequent charge for blankets for the prisons. Can you point out any of the particulars to which you allude?— I have examined the printed presentments, and I find in almost every one of those presentments, a charge for blankets, in some instances to a considerable amount; as much as three hundred pairs at one term. Are you acquainted with the prices at which those articles are supplied, or the mode which is taken to procure them 011 the cheapest terms?— I am not intimately acquainted with the subject, but in the course of a visit which I recently made to Newgate, I saw a number of convicts clothed in what I was tolJ were old blankets, and as far as I can judge, those blankets cut up for clothing for them appeared to be perfectly sufficient for the use of the goal. I attribute to that circumstance the large, and perhaps unnecessary supply of blankets, which appears in the present- ment sheets; there are many and various other instances to which I could refer. Will you turn to page 102, you see there the names of the grand jury of the city of Dublin. Are you acquainted with the greater portion of those gentlemen?— I know them by character, but only a few of them personally. Are they individuals belonging to the corporation of the city of Dublin ?— They are members of the corporation of the city of Dublin. Do you mean, by their being members of the corporation of the city of Dublin, that they are the freemen at large, or the higher authorities?— They are all aldermen, sheriff's peers, or members of the common council. Will you look over the names of the individuals in the first page, to w hom pre- sentments of the public money are made by the grand jury, and will you state whether many of them are aiso members of the corporation of the city of Dublin ?— A considerable proportion of them are members of the corporation. Does the name of Alderman Exsliaw appear upon that list of the grand jury?— It does. Look at page 109 ; is there not there a presentment for stationery, supplied for the use of the several grand juries of the city of Dublin, 132/; who is the John Exshaw to whom that presentment is made ?— Alderman John ExsRaw. The same individual who was a member of the grand jury ?— Unquestionably. And who was a party to the presentments so made to'himself?— Unquestionably. Will you turn to the preceding term, and see if there is any other presentment for the