SELECT COMMITTEE ON FICTITIOUS VOTES, IRELAND. 4 41 have any care for what they were doing ; Mr. Lefroy has assisted them to build houses. 7314. Giving- them the same advantage as you give to Protestant tenants, do not you find the same efforts for the improvement, and amendment of their farms ?— They are very industrious, but I do not think they have the same ideas of cultivating their farms with neatness ; they may take as much out of the ground as men of any other creed or politics, I admit; but there is such a thing as hedging a farm, quicking, draining, fencing; this sort of things I think latterly they have set to do upon the farms, but when I first saw them there was nothing of the sort. 7315. At that time the farms were small and subdivided ?— They were. 7316. Paupers occupying a good deal of the land ?— A great many. 7317. would you know a Protestant farm from a Roman- catholic farm by the eye if the man had the encouragement you speak of?— I will not say that I would know it. In the South of Ireland I know that the farms are very superior, and they are tilled by Roman- catholics generally. 7318. Would Lord Lorton have any difficulty in getting Roman- catholics from the North to cultivate his flax for him ?— We did not strive for them. 7319. But you could have got them ?— I never inquired after them. 7320. You never inquired in the county of Tyrone ?— They are not supposed to know so much about it. 7321. You are aware that the county of Armagh, in which there is a large Catholic population, is one of the great linen counties of Ireland ?— It is; I make 110 doubt that Roman- catholics could be got, though I never inquired for them. 7322. Chairman.] Do you think that a Roman- catholic tenant, not belonging to the district of country, would be well received if he dispossessed other parties ? I do not think he would. 7323. Mr. O'Connell. Would not they be as apt to murder him in most parts as a Protestant?— I do not think they would. 7324. You are aware that in the South of Ireland almost all the agrarian murders are committed upon Roman- catholics?— They were. 7325. Did you go as registrar when Dr. Lefroy went the circuit as judge?— I did. When I have extended the farms of Roman- catholics upon this estate of Lord Lorton's and upon Mr. Lefroy's, though the lands were taken from Roman- catholics, in 110 instance have any of the persons been interfered with, or had their cattle injured, or houghed, or themselves beaten at fair or market, although they had got their holdings enlarged by land being taken from other Roman- catholics. Rut it is not so with the Protestants, for in every instance they either beat or killed them, or took their cattle. 7326. Are any of those Protestants Orangemen ?— I do not know. 7327- 8. Did you hear that they were r— They might have been, but I have no way of ascertaining. I am not an Orangeman myself, and never was. 7329. Do you know that they make a distinction between a Protestant and an Orangeman?— I think the lower order of vulgar- minded people amongst the Protestants do conceive that if a man is not an Orangeman he is not a thorough- going Protestant. That sort of thing may exist amongst a few of them, but it is only amongst the very lowest. 7330. Have you prepared in your office any rent- charges to register votes in the county of Longford ?— A few. 7331. Will you state as nearly as you can what you mean by a few ?— Not six. 7332. Were any of those for a pecuniary consideration where money was paid as the purchase ?— No ; I have said six, but I can think of but three instances of mv having: prepared rent- charges. 7333• Were those voluntary gifts in order to enable the party to register r-- They were given with the express understanding that money was to be paid. 7334. Was the purchase money paid?— No; but the annual sum granted was to be paid of course. 7335. There was no purchase money paid ?-— No money paid. 7336. Was there any money secured bond fide to be paid ?— No purchase money. 7337. They were therefore granted in order to entitle the party to register r— To entitle the party to receive the sum granted, and I saw it paid. 7338. Rut for the registry they would not have been thought of in all proba- bility ?— Perhaps not. 643. c 7339 T. Courlenay, Esq. 27 March 1838. Do