\ 254 MINUTES OF EVIDENCE TAKEN BEFORE THE Rev E M'Gaver. 12458. How do you know that Captain Walker was so pleased with seeing this J man upon the treadmill ?— The person that was suffering said to me that he used 29 May 1838. to come in when it came to his turn; Gaintry said that such was his feeling towards him. ... 12459. Do you mean to say that he had no business in the gaol., except to see this man upon the treadmill?— He was connected with the gaol. 12460. Then why was his presence, during the time thai this man was upon the treadmill, a proof that he took pleasure in it ?— Whether he expressed himself so I cannot say, but he was actually there. 12461. That information was derived from the individual that was on the tread- mill ?— Yes. 12462. And upon that authority you state that Captain Walker went there for the sake of the pleasure of seeing this man on the treadmill ?— I gave this state- ment with an explanation. 12463. Mr. O'Connell.] You had this fact from Gaintry that Captain Walker used to come constantly when he was upon the treadmill, and that he did not go to see others ?— Yes. 12464. Did Gaintry tell you that he did not go to see others r— I do not know, but it is well known that he does not go to see all. 12465. Chairman.] This is part of the gossip upon which you have already stated various facts?— It comes from Gaintry himself. 12466. Mr. O'Connell.'] When you used the word " gossip,'' do you mean public report?— Yes. 12467. Mr . Lefroy.] You consider that as sufficient foundation upon which to make the charge against Captain Walker that you have stated in your evidence ?— As far as Captain Walker is concerned, and that individual case, with the expla- nation I have given, I think it sufficient to give information to this Committee. 12468. Mr. O'Connell.] You do not charge it further than by the information you have stated ?— No further. 12469. Chairman.] Generally speaking, do you say that the Roman- catholic tenants are inclined to go against the wishes of their landlords?— They do not go against their landlords as landlords, but they go against their landlords whenever they conceive the landlords take a wrong view of politics. 12470. There is a great proportion of the property in the county of Longford connected with the side adverse to the Liberal cause?— There is. 12471. Can you state what proportion ?— No, I cannot. 12472. Mr. O'Connell.] The Whites have estates there?— They have. 12473. They are in the Liberal interest?— Yes, and Mr. Fuite has some pro- perty, and Sir Percy Nugent; the two Mr. Murphys have property there, and Lord Sutherland has extensive property, but the majority of them are on the Con- servative side. 12474. The Roman- catholic tenantry, as a body connected with that majority of property, are inclined to go against the political opinions of their landlords ?— I think they are. 12475. Mr. O'' Connell.] Their political feeling being hostile to the Catholics? — Yes. 12476. And in the county of Longford exceedingly hostile?— Exceedingly hos- tile ; so much so, that some of the Catholic tenantry said they would rather lose their lives than continue in that state. I can mention an instance, the wife of one going off to Longford ; he was living under a landlord who persecuted as far as he could ; she said, " Do not mind what your neighbours do, but I call upon you now as a wife to take the advice of your priest, if not you and I will live no longer to- gether." I had that from the husband afterwards ; he was laughing at it; he told me the injunction that was laid upon him by his wife. 12477. The wife laid upon him an injunction to do as the priest directed him? — Yes. In the spring of 1835, immediately after the election of Longford, as a man of the name of James Nolan, and his son, were bringing in flax- seed, he was met by 200 or 300 others who had voted at the beck of their landlord. They beat him cruelly ; he came in his blood to me ; I asked him to go at once and lodge informations ; he did go to Mr. Linen, who refused to take his informations. He then went on to Captain Pollock, of Castle who took his informations. Captain Pollock sent a warrant directly to the police station in Carrickboy; they declined acting upon that warrant, and they came some time afterwards and ar- rested Nolan, the father, and his two sons; took them out of their beds ; they handcuffed