no We ON THE LOCAL TAXATION OF THE CITY OF DUBLIN. 95 or spirituous liquors, in case it should be judged advisable to do so?— I should Rev. give my decided approbation to a clause, compelling all prisoners to take the gaol p• Gamble. allowance. v Is not that clause in the prison law ?— I have received an opinion from autho- ( 9 May'-) rity, that it was not. Supposing a case of a prisoner receiving the gaol allowance, do you imagine that there is a power vested in any authority, to allow that prisoner to receive supplies from his friends, in addition to the gaol allowance ?— No ; I do not think any officer would be borne out, under the Act of Parliament, in allowing it; but I have known cases which called for interference. Have you ever known any criminals removed to the debtors side?— I have; we call it the State side, what was originally called the Debtor side ; by the late provi- sions of the Act of Parliament there are no debtors allowed. But before the late alteration, have you ever known any criminals removed to the debtor side ?— I have. In more cases than one ?— I have. Was there any fee or emolument, or rent, charged upon criminals so removed to a better apartment?— I do believe they paid a rent for a better apartment. To whom ?— To the gaoler. Do you consider such practice to be according to law?— No, I do not consider that practice to be according to law; but that the gaoler had a right to demand a rent for a room previous to the Act of last session. Do you consider, that, according to the 50th of George the Third, he had any right to remove a criminal to the debtor side of the prison?— No. Then you conceive it to be contrary to law ?— I do. Did you, in your official capacity, ever make any remonstrance on the subject?— I did. To whom ?— To the gaoler, the deputy gaoler, and the clerk. In consequence of the remonstrances which you so properly made, was the prac- tice discontinued; did it cease?— Indeed I think there were five instances of the case that I have mentioned ; but I rather think it required repeated remonstrances to stop it. Did it altogether cease up to the moment of the late alterations by government authority ?— The Act of Parliament was enforced by a counter order from the court of King's Bench; and from that moment it ceased in toto. When was that?— I should think that was about three months ago. Up to three months ago, it continued?— It did. How long has your official connection with the prisons of Dublin lasted ?— From the year 1814 When did this practice, of allowing criminals to be placed among debtors, accord- ing to your best recollection, begin ?— I am not cognizant of prisoners being removed from the felon side to the state side in many instances; but I am aware that prisoners coming in and going to the state side, were obliged to pay. a rent. By the state side, you describe the debtor side?— Yes. You stated there was a difference between Newgate and other gaols, that you had not the same control in Newgate over the contractor; if the potatoes furnished in Newgate were of bad quality, you could not compel the contractor to change them, for what reason is that?— Because the other prisons are more directly under the magistrates of the head office; and though they have not the grand jury money in their hands, they have no objection to buy potatoes out of the funds in their hands, and wait till the grand jury re- presented it. With respect to the gaol of Newgate, such is not the case ; they have not the same power. You are then obliged to take bad provisions in Newgate from the contractors ?— No; they are not taken in any instance. Who is the apothecary of the prison ?— Messrs. Craven and Nichols. Who performs the duty?— Both in turn ; and sometimes, when bleeding is neces- sary, or a minor operation, persons of their establishment. Are the duties performed by them to your satisfaction?— I have never heard a complaint. You consider them to be good officers, administering their functions under the existing law ?— I consider them to be good officers, and most respectable men. Do they discharge the duties of apothecary according to law ?— Decidedly so. Do they attend the physician in his visits?— Not always. 549- 11 " 1807: